RRL now offering paid ads

Responses

  1. mooderino (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    I think you do have a point but bear in mind the vast majority of readers on RRL aren't members of the site and don't leave reviews.

    Do all the stories with terrible reviews and thousands of readers not appeal to the audience. Obviously they do (although god knows why). Is the site there to cater for the audience or the writers?

    As for Wattpad I think that system works but only for a very small number of books, which is great if you're one of the chosen. But I don't think it's a great system.

    I don't value many people's opinions on what they think is good. A big website thinks I should read this? No thanks.

    On the other hand if each writer also recommended other books on his profile, so if you like his stories maybe you'll share his tastes, I can see that working if handled right. But then do writers really want readers to focus on the competition? Why promote others when you find it hard enough to promote yourself. And would it devolve into a circle jerk with people trading support? I don't know how well that would work.

  2. Chrysalis (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    But paying to be noticed is better than any of the other suggestions? I still disagree. :P

    Anathema, a web serial about the effect superpowers would have on our world. http://anathemaserial.wordpress.com/
  3. mooderino (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    And I agree with your disagree; it isn't the best, but at the same time it won't take eyes away from a story that already wasn't getting any attention. And if it makes RRL a little money to keep feeding the hamsters powering the servers, meh.

  4. Dary (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    But then do writers really want readers to focus on the competition? Why promote others when you find it hard enough to promote yourself.

    Because anyone who says "I'm not supporting other creatives because they're competition" comes across as a narcissistic ass?

  5. mooderino (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    It may be selfish, petty, insecure but I don't see how it's narcissistic. And I don't really mean it in an assholey way, just the energy required to type up even a short review after I've churned out another chapter of my own is hard to come by these day.

  6. Dary (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    That's slightly different, though. That's not you saying "I'm not going to give this a good review because it's my competitor".

  7. unice5656 (Moderator)

    Posted 3 years ago

    RRL has quite a different reader base and publishing style than Wattpad, or FictionPress, or Inkitt, or many other sites. It's not looking to copy other models but rather forge its own.

    This paid placement thing is a feature that's going on trial, but I don't think you need to worry about it. The very vast majority of people who publish on RRL are readers who are trying out writing on a whim. If you look at the percentage of stories that are still updating after a year, it's probably around 10%. These writers aren't the ones who are striving to become professional writers, and neither are they people who will pay to promote their fictions.

    Most of the complaints people have about the rankings revolve around the Top Weekly and Top Monthly lists. Honestly, fame on those lists is transient and generally quite toxic. The stories that get on those lists update so frequently that quality suffers, and the number of negative reviews piles up. Even with sub-par writing, it's an unsustainable update pace, and the rankings change quite frequently. You're better off going the slow and steady route, collecting fans with regular updates, even if those updates are slow.

    As for "quality-based" listings, I don't think that's going to happen for a very long time, unless you can come up with an automated way to rank quality. Believe it or not, RRL is run by three admins, who do it full-time, and a handful of moderators, who are unpaid and quite busy with life. If a new person were hired to help run the site, another programmer is way higher on the priority list than a curator.

    However, like I said before, new listings and chances for different stories to gain exposure will come with future updates. Lesser-known but highly rated stories will show up on the Rising Stars list. The tag system will be overhauled so that readers can use Advanced Search to better find the stories they're looking for. RRL is not going to turn into a site where you have to pay to get noticed just because the option is there.

  8. Blaise Corvin (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    ^ This.

    Visit my site, http://www.blaise-corvin.com. I have punch and pie.
    I also have two stories: Delvers LLC and The Crimson Artifice. :)
  9. mooderino (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    @Blaise I noticed you took out one of the ads, was wondering how well it worked for you. Did it give you a spike in viewers? Worth the investment?

  10. Chrysalis (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    Are you saying that only those who strive to become professional writers would pay for ads? I don't think that's the case. Professional writers look to make money from their writing, not pay to let people read it for free.

    It's just going to be a question of 'who can spare the cash' vs 'who can't'. The depth of your pockets has nothing to do with motivation or talent.

    Anathema, a web serial about the effect superpowers would have on our world. http://anathemaserial.wordpress.com/
  11. FrustratedEgo (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    I had one of the staff members on RRL run an average showing first / last updates for stories - and used that to measure the average. Apparently most stories only last about 2 months before the author wanders off.

    I say this because as Unice pointed out above; "The very vast majority of people who publish on RRL are readers who are trying out writing on a whim." - and they're completely right.

    A lot of people here are coming at it from the other direction, or have gone cross site because of a higher aim. (More than idle smashing of the keyboard with our faces and praying some words make sense) - however from a seeking donations or ROI - I don't think the ads will help much.

    Seriously trying to make the writing gig pay a little back is tough. I can't see much coming back aside from hits; people who would have liked a serious story of length / value / decent writing - have probably already searched by keywords or tags. Fictions that are popping up on this paid ad system are actually outright annoying me - because I've already read them or attempted to do so in most cases. (Sorry Blaise)

    I do like the part where fans can actually sponsor fictions they like. That would be a neat way to give back for those that are hardcore obsessed. Granted a Reddit mention or something would probably be better / cheaper.

  12. unice5656 (Moderator)

    Posted 3 years ago

    @Chrysalis

    I'm saying only people actually trying to accomplish something with their writing would pay for ads. Plus, the base quality and regular updates have to be there, or you could be featured permanently on the front page of the site and still never gain a decent-sized reader base.

    Honestly, it's not that big of a deal. Plenty of readers don't even go on the front page. Even if you pay for an ad, I'd say that a significant portion of your views will still come off the Latest Updates list.

  13. Blaise Corvin (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    @mooderino I feel like the investment has been good for me. The CTR is extremely high and I've acquired almost 100 new followers already.

    @Chrysalis I honestly don't understand your irritation here. Are you advocating that nobody else should pay for promotion because you either can't or won't? Real life doesn't work that way.

    Perhaps the issue is the perception that we're competing. See, I don't see it that way. The way I see it, I'm on an island trying to build my own brand. What other people do or don't do doesn't affect me either way.

    "Fair" isn't even remotely relevant in this space because there is no competition. If I gain one of your readers, you don't lose a reader. Therefor, there is no reason to be frustrated about the success of another writer, regardless of how they get it.

    Visit my site, http://www.blaise-corvin.com. I have punch and pie.
    I also have two stories: Delvers LLC and The Crimson Artifice. :)
  14. Chrysalis (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    I'm not worried about losing readers, I'm barely active or visible on RRL anyway. The bulk of my followers is coming from WFG / TWF and it's always been that way, ever since I listed Anathema nearly 2 years ago.

    I just disagree with the principle of paying to advertise something that doesn't make you money. We're already offering up our time and effort for free, and I've always seen web fiction as a sandbox of sorts where everyone has equal chances to get noticed based on how much effort they put into their writing and how many readers like their stories. If you start getting money involved, that whole principle goes downhill.

    It's not about RRL, it's about the principle of how free web fiction works and has always worked.

    I pay for Facebook / Amazon ads, but those ads sell my books. :P I don't give those books away for free.

    Anathema, a web serial about the effect superpowers would have on our world. http://anathemaserial.wordpress.com/
  15. Dary (Member)

    Posted 3 years ago

    it's about the principle of how free web fiction works and has always worked

    Except that's not "how it's always worked". See: webcomics.

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